Admiral's Challange Feb 2020 (Spoilers)

[MilesPrower Dagger]

I'm going to try starting these up again to see if people are interested:

So in the two new series, they have stressed or at least gotten a large response on cursing. What are your thoughts on this? Is it good, bad, overhyped since its been in trek before?

[MilesPrower Dagger]

I am personally mostly indifferent, I liked the "Oh Shit" in generations because of how they worked it into a character who is supposed to be super controlled. To me its just language and how it is used, in Picard to me it was a normal reply, something Star Trek has done well, making the people or situations relatable. I really disliked the main use in Discovery because of the, to me, ridiculous amount of hype it got within the show itself. Overall I don't care as long as it's done for a purpose and done well.

[3249Rowena]

Should these kind of colourful metaphors be in a Star Trek show or film? Depends on the context whether it's gratuitous or not. If it's just dropped in to show "Hey! look how more adult we are than "old" Trek, we're so cool!" or to shock, then that is just lazy writing. Yawn.

Interestingly (well to me anyway) the British Board of Film Classification consumer guidance for Discovery Season 1, which has a 15 certificate over here in the UK, is "Strong Violence, Sex, Gory Images" No mention of what the board usually terms "Strong language"

[Drewski Northman]

I'll bite on this one!

I am not really a fan of stronger cursing in Star Trek, personally. I don't have a problem with cursing in general, as there are shows and movies where you kinda expect it. For example, The Witcher ep 4 had the greatest use and delivery of "f*ck" I've seen in...anything. However, I would also never want to watch The Witcher with my kids either. There has always been a different precedent set with Trek.

Now, I don't have children yet, but I hope to some time soon, and Trek is something that I very much want to share with them. I grew up with some of my earliest memories being watching Star Trek. It's been a part of my life and imagination since I was little, and I would hope that it's something I can share with the next generation (heh) as well without worrying about my kids dropping f bombs.

Really though, I guess it's all rather relative. Commander Rose brought up the British rating system, and there were episodes of TOS that weren't shown there till the 90s due to content deemed too violent or traumatic. We'd look at that and go "wow really? That's nothing." Perhaps we will look at "f*ck" and other terms that are currently deemed more vulgar now the same way in 20-30 years. I dunno.

[Kermie Mistwallow]

I'm English, I have Children and I curce (but never in front of my children and even call people out to aplogize if they curse in frnt of my chidlren)

As for Cursing in Trek, the way they did it in Picard was awesome, there was no hype, there was not drawing to it (like they did with Tilly in Discovery, they drew alot of attention to it then rpeated it in the same scene). Picard was done with class and with the distinction that was perfect in my opinion.

[3249Rowena]

It was the decision of the original UK broadcaster, good old Auntie BBC, not to broadcast or repeat four episodes of TOS on its initial UK transmissions due to concerns over content.

The forbidden fruit however was available to UK fans, when CIC started releasing the series on VHS (hands up who remembers that) in the late 1980's. A couple of the BBC banned episodes were included in the first pre-cert releases in 1983 (One release had "The Empath: Never shown on television in the UK" prominently displayed on the front cover) No cuts are listed as being required on the BBFC website.

I guess this kind of illustrates Drewski's point (and drags me back to the subject of the thread ahem). Peoples attitudes change over time. What was considered shocking then is now "meh" and its the same in regards to language.

You hear much stronger swearing all the time: on the street, in the shops etc. It's arguable that we've become numbed to its impact now its really part of everyday speech, to the point a general audience wouldn't bat an eyelid to someone dropping an F bomb or two on the set of a Federation starship.

It is a great shame that, we have all this new material coming out, but a younger audience (and future fans) will be possibly be excluded from a large part of it. I guess it boils down to this: What age group is Star Trek aimed at now?

[Drewski Northman]

It is a great shame that, we have all this new material coming out, but a younger audience (and future fans) will be possibly be excluded from a large part of it. I guess it boils down to this: What age group is Star Trek aimed at now?

Yeah that’s my feeling exactly, and you cut right to the heart of the issue. What audience are they targeting?

[iamwakingup Resident]

Roddenberry's original series was aimed towards teenage and adults, not little children, as it was in the 730pm to 800pm slot on Monday nights back in the 60s. It was only due to low ratings, it moved to 1000pm. Later series as STNG, DS9, Voy, Ent, Disc and Picard seem to be aimed towards the same age groups (they call it PG13) with its topics dealing in drug addiction, terrorism, racism, homosexuality. The cursing seems to be an added element to public TV that has been trickling in since NYPD Blue series and paid cable service shows, since PG13 shows are slowly flooding networks.
Trek isnt a big surprise to me, personally...anyone seen Titans?
Titans is a comic book series TV show, to date DC comic heroes like the Titans dont swear in the pages of the comics, the TV series is throwing the f-word like nothing trying to make them sound all serious, bad behind. Superheroes never needed to swear to be bad behind in my own opinion.

[Reina Beaumont]

If it's too overused then it wears thin fast, in tense situations it's understandable but not near constantly. I feel they've overplayed it, especially in Picard.

[David A Whitaker]

It's been mentioned that cursing is not so bad as long as it has a purpose. I concur. ST: Picard did have a lot of cursing, but it also had a main character splattering an enemy - and not vaporizing them as would have been the case in earlier series.

Picard did explore darker themes - someone murdering someone else(and it being ok in the end with no repercussions) and "splattering" another person to bloody droplets. I am sure Roddenberry would have never allowed such graphic use of violence, but this is another day and age.

As for the target audience, fans of TNG, IMO. I understand the element of non-children friendly content. I argue that some of those episodes are best left to a Wikipedia summary for someone too young, and move along. Just an opinion.

Discovery was way overhyped. I hope that now it is "Free from Canon" it will be a more balanced show.

[Andrew Kerr]

Very late to this party……

The best use of cursing in Star Trek was in Star Trek Generations when the Enterprise had separated and helm control was offline and they where in an uncontrolled decent to veridian III with the line from data “oh shit”

However special mention to chief miles obrien, on bajor when molly falls through the time portal and obrien is working frantically to get it online and the generator explodes and his like “oh bollocks”

[Kanashio Resident]

Cursing in general has a degenerative effect. If it's unexpected from an individual, it has value in contexts where surprise, shock, or strong emotion are demonstrated. If an individual swears all the time, it's just meh, part of the zeitgeist of that character, and is just words. In other words, how do *you* want to sound? Dealers choice I suppose.