Admiral’s Challenge September 2018 (2)

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MilesPrower Dagger
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180911.1809

I talked about some harder ones, lets see if people like these.

I was watching Next Generation with my friend last night and the episode "Ethics" came on and we got into an interesting discussion. Before you just to conclusions nothing about this question applies to the real world it is all something that took place in the show.

Why did Worf ask Riker of all people in the Galaxy to preform the Hegh'bat?
Why not Kurn, his brother who would not have not hesitated?

Throughout Picard seems to be advocating for accepting Worf's culture, telling Crusher and Riker they are applying human values to Klingon culture.
It is well known that Worf has more respect and reverence for Picard than he has for anyone else, why didn't he ask Picard to do it?
Would Picard have done it?

An issue my friend brought up that is somewhat off the topic but a good idea to think about, why was Picard so willing to embrace Wolf's culture in this instance yet when he killed Duras in the Rite of Vengeance he was very upset and had a demerit put on his Starfleet Record?
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Kem Vala
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MilesPrower Dagger wrote:
180911.1809
It is well known that Worf has more respect and reverence for Picard than he has for anyone else, why didn't he ask Picard to do it?
No doubt, because of Warf's immense respect for the Captain, he chose Ryker instead. For the Captain to engage in the ritual, would have been an almost menial task. Ryker, on the other hand could almost be considered a peer of Warf, making it acceptable for a "comrade" to administer the rite.

I see it as a military attitude. I would not have asked the Division Commander to officiate at my wedding... the Captain, on the other hand, would fit the bill nicely because we are in a closer working relationship, and he also has the authority. (Army terms, not Navy)
Those who know a principle and do not do it, they are slaves by nature -- Aristotle
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Greenlantern Excelsior
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Good questions!
MilesPrower Dagger wrote:
180911.1809
Why did Worf ask Riker of all people in the Galaxy to preform the Hegh'bat?
Why not Kurn, his brother who would not have not hesitated?
It appears that Kurn was a member of the Klingon High Council from 2367-2372, so he wouldn't have been available on the Enterprise-D in 2368 to do this. Also, Riker says "You are my friend. And in spite of everything I've said, if it were my place, I would probably help you. But I've been studying Klingon ritual and Klingon law, and I've discovered that it's not my place to fill that role. According to tradition, that honor falls to a family member. Preferably the oldest son." (Alexander)

Reference: Kurn
Reference: Ethics
MilesPrower Dagger wrote:
180911.1809
Throughout Picard seems to be advocating for accepting Worf's culture, telling Crusher and Riker they are applying human values to Klingon culture.
It is well known that Worf has more respect and reverence for Picard than he has for anyone else, why didn't he ask Picard to do it?
Would Picard have done it?
I doubt Picard would have done it. He would have found some preachy way to get out of it, or told Worf to find a Klingon to do it.
MilesPrower Dagger wrote:
180911.1809
An issue my friend brought up that is somewhat off the topic but a good idea to think about, why was Picard so willing to embrace Wolf's culture in this instance yet when he killed Duras in the Rite of Vengeance he was very upset and had a demerit put on his Starfleet Record?
"Worf says that he has acted properly and legally under Klingon law, but Picard tells Worf that while the Klingons do indeed consider the matter closed, he cannot. He reminds Worf that when people join Starfleet, they agree to abide by the laws of the Federation, including the one against murder, and if their culture and beliefs prevent them from doing so, they should resign." He said this in 2367, so he would have been quite a hypocrite if he murdered Worf in 2368.

Reference: Reunion

Another little weirdness - in the Hegh'bat ritual, Klingon 1 hands Klingon 2 a knife, and Klingon 2 then stabs himself to death. In the Mauk-to'Vor ritual, Klingon 1 stabs Klingon 2 to death. Seems like they had way too many forms of ritual suicide.
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Kes Ellison
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I have to agree with Hal that 1. Worf wouldn't have asked Picard because of his respect for him. To Worf, Picard is a mentor, not a peer. 2. Picard wouldn't have done it, for the same reasons, and while I don't know if he would have told him to get a Klingon, I do think he would have suggested a peer instead. 3. Picard does respect Klingon traditions, but, Federation Law is what Picard (and Worf when he signed up for Starfleet) are bound by. If it had been a Klingon Citizen, instead of Worf, while Picard personally my not have approved, he would have let the matter drop. However, when it's a Starfleet officer, under his direct command no less, he had no choice but to issue the reprimand (Worf is lucky that's all it was), I think Picard actually handled that fairly. He recognized that Worf did what he felt he must (which is probably why it wasn't worse), but now Picard had to do what he felt he must to.
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180912.0632

Riker was the closest thing Worf had to a "brother" of sorts aboard the ship, and Kurn would have been off and doing things in the Empire for Worf to bother him with it, and wait the extra time being a burden on everyone. The point that Picard was his Captain, and mentor is pretty spot on, plus with the way he had handled Worf's acting in "Klingon Law and Tradition" in the past, he'd probably believe Picard would back out. Picard is willing to accept Worf's culture this episode /I/ think, because It's not something that's going to physically harm anyone else but Worf, and im pretty sure by the 24th century assisted suicide is considered humane.

ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THIS EPISODE!

It absolutely annoyed me to no end how Crusher treated Dr Russell for offering Worf an experimental procedure without her approval. Yes we got a bit of an understanding of HER Ethics later on when she experimented on the colonist, killing them in the process, but with Worf considering killing himself anyway, it just irked me that Crusher was preaching "Patients are people with feelings too", and didn't want to give Worf the option that ultimately worked out for him.
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